Microsoft DV Compression?

We are all restricted to the max datarate of dv and the resolution of dv as to quality.

If that is where the final piece will end up , that is the quality you will get.

If you alter the data in any way , it will need to be re-encoded at the end of the alteration.

You can export from premiere to after effects in uncompressed , edit in after effects , and load back into premiere , but personally , i'm not sure you will gain much in quality compared to extra time taken to do this.

I have seen the animators at my work place using quicktime mov as output files for after effects. Then it is converted to Matrox Compression without any loss to quality.... i.e. no flickering of text, no edges etc.

Same is the case when i export the text animations in uncompressed... but as soon as it is rendered in microsoft dv the quality is lost. Is micrsoft dv an inferior compression to Matrox?

1. which version of microsoft directx , which is where the dv codec is installed from ?
directx8 or 9 should be good , previous versions weren't according to some people , though i don't remember using microsoft dv codec much before version 8.

2. which matrox compression ?

if it is dv , i wouldn't have said that it was better than microsofts , at least not on my rt2000's.
matrox dv is a 2 file system on rt2000 , one for video , one for sound.

have a look at this for a workaround using mainconcept codec
http://www.abcdv.com/article/articleview/10/1/79/

i have the latest directx 9.0c

and matrox digisuite M-JPEG and the other rtx.100 card supports... the quality seems much better than microsft dv...

Generally, the MS DV codec is not as good as the competition. QT's very good.

The reason why there's some difference is that the only requirement is that the data stream must be decodable by all the decoders. Since the compressor's job is to decide what parts of the spatio-temporal frequency content is "invisible" to the eye, it is free to decisions as to what's kept and what's junked. Some are better at doing that than others. However, they all end up as 25Mb/s and there are no controls that you can get access to to define how the compression's done. What's indisputable though, is that any recompression done in NLE will make the pictures lokk a little worse because it gets harder to decide what's real picture and what's the "products of combustion", the detritus left over by the previous compression. For that reason, it makes sense to keep the number of generations to a minimum. This does not apply to tape-tape copying via Firewire, because then you get a clone of the tape with no recompression.

Thanks for the info... I also wanted to know if fields make a difference. I have some scenes which is in lower field and some with no field... will it pose a problem in the end..? cause after applying some effects in after effects the exported video gives me jumping black frames in between, when i use lowerfields...

Thanks for the info... I also wanted to know if fields make a difference. I have some scenes which is in lower field and some with no field... will it pose a problem in the end..? cause after applying some effects in after effects the exported video gives me jumping black frames in between, when i use lowerfields... but with no fields its okay

I guess you're talking about the settings rather than the actual fields. The normal setting for DV in 625/50 interlaced is lower-field dominance. I don't know what you mean by "no field".

yeah sorry... i meant the settings at nofields.. i.e. not interlaced.... if i have some scenes interlaced and some not.. will it show adverse behaviour while playing out on different mediums (cause there are many different TVs)

I know the with the setting at nofields there are some edges... but i am okay, cause its still better than the jumping black frames..

Set it correct for interlaced. Then everything should be right.

When capturing the card and the software will capture with a dominent field normally lower field
if using ANY composite or external program u must keep the fields in the right order on export.
if your using After effects there are a lot of settings that need applying before you export

Make sure you are using the Render Queue to export not
Ok in the render que there are three groups of settings that must be set right

1)"current settings" go into this
you will probably want it like this

QUALITY=Best
RESOLOUTION=Full

FIELD SETTINGS=Lower (unless you know you are using uppper field first)
the other settings in this section can be left as they are or use you judgement

2)OUTPUT MODULE

FORMAT=Video for windows
FORMAT OPTION= (click on the compression button)
you want either No compression (your editor will render this to play)
or select you codec from the list eg microsoft DV
or canopus dv depends on what you use.
IF YOU SELECT NO COMPRESSION then YOU MUST specify a Data rate 4000 or above or you will lose quality.

make sure the tick boxes are on for either video and/or audio whatever you want.

The last section is just the filename, i won't go into this.

Hope this is not to confusing, but then again after effects is confusing

how can i set it correct for interlace. which settings do I have to play around with.

And Mardy i usually have the same settings that you mentioned, but still i am getting jumping black frames when i export in lower fields. It depends on different effects, for example i use magic bullet for giving different looks to my footage. While some looks work perfectly with lower field, some looks have the jumping black problem... which can be rectified with no field setting

MJPEG is better suited to CGI than DV

i dunno about the black frames as for the flickering make sure that the files coming into after effects are set at the right field setting.

You could try this .
Export them with no fields
Put them into premiere and right click on the clip and choose "field options" then select
"Interlace consecutive frames"

will that turn it into lower fields... i tried it, but nothing happened.. it didn't ask for rendering as well...